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In Rochester, More Doctors Firing Parents for Refusing to Vaccinate Their Kids

Reported by: Evan Dawson
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Updated: 9/14/2012 6:50 pm

A small but growing number of doctors in the Rochester area are joining doctors across the country who have decided to dismiss patients who refuse to have their infants vaccinated.
 
The process has become known as "firing parents," and it's a controversial practice because the American Academy of Pediatrics advises against it. But pediatricians have seen a rise in the number of parents refusing vaccines for their children, and some have decided to send a stern message.
 
"This was not even on the radar ten or twenty years ago," says Dr. Michael Pichichero of Legacy Pediatrics in Rochester. "We almost never had parents challenging the validity of vaccines. But now I'd say one in twenty families are challenging vaccines, with many of those parents outright refusing them for their kids."
 
Dr. Pichichero does not fire parents who take this route, but his colleague, Dr. Janet Casey, does. Dr. Casey has not wanted to comment publicly on the practice, but Dr. Pichichero says he empathizes with her.
 
"This is not easy," Dr. Pichichero says. "For me, I'd rather stay in contact with parents who refuse vaccines, because I want to continue to give them good information and monitor the health of their children. And fortunately, I'm often able to change their minds."
 
Dr. Pichichero estimates that when confronted with families who question vaccines, he's able to convince 80 percent of parents to have their children vaccinated. "It comes down to the fact that they've been getting bad information. When they hear of the risks of not having babies vaccinated, they want to do what's best for their child."
 
For parents who persist in declining vaccines, Dr. Pichichero requires them to sign a statement acknowledging the risk that comes with the decision. "That is often where they draw the line," Dr. Pichichero says. "They don't want to sign that document. That's when the danger becomes real. I've seen a baby literally cough to death from whooping cough. It's not hypothetical."
 
So why does Dr. Casey, for example, handle this issue differently? Dr. Pichichero says doctors who fire parents are primarily concerned about exposure to other children.
 
"The big issue is the waiting room," he explains. "When you choose not to have your child vaccinated, you're potentially exposing other children. Yes, other kids are often vaccinated. But there are families that will come in to our office before they've had the chance to have their newborns vaccinated. When they're in the waiting room, we don't want them to be vulnerable because other parents have not made good decisions." Dr. Pichichero added that vaccines aren't perfectly effective, meaning even vaccinated children could be at risk.
 
A recent study found that 30% of 133 pediatricians in the state of Connecticut have recently fired parents for refusing vaccines, and a separate survey of 909 midwestern doctors found that 21% did the same. A decade ago, only 6% of pediatricians routinely took the same approach, according to the American Academy of Pediatrics.
 
The Wall Street Journal reported on this issue earlier this year.
 
13 WHAM News has heard from parents of other practices who were "fired" for refusing vaccines, but those doctors were similarly reluctant to speak publicly about the issue. Some parents are offended by the idea that they might be dismissed.
 
We met Krysten Glor in Canandaigua, the mother of two healthy boys, ages 4 and 2. She disputes Dr. Pichichero's comment that "parents can be influenced by celebrities and celebrity doctors who have made factually dubious comments about vaccines."
 
"This is not about celebrities," Glor told us. "I'm concerned enough to do my own research." She says the heavy metals, along with other components in vaccines, are a problem. "The monkey and the mouse and the different cells that are in there, it just doesn't feel right to me. Formaldehyde, those things don't feel right to put into my kid."
 
Dr. Pichichero says that's an example of an uneducated position. "There is no evidence that aluminum in vaccines, for example, does any long-term harm," he says. "We're not asking parents to put their children in danger. We're asking them to take a step that protects their kids."
 
Glor, who says other parents have referred to her as a "quacky mom," has no plans to change her mind. "It seems easier to nurse a child through an illness rather than have them get something more severe due to a vaccine," she says. If her pediatrician dismissed her family based on this stance, Glor would find another practice.
 
But at Legacy Pediatrics, many parents have expressed gratitude for the firm stance of Dr. Casey. They appreciate the idea that their kids are not placed at risk when they pay a visit. "When parents are dismissed, we've seen some real surprise," Dr. Pichichero says. "It might shock them into really considering their actions."

Other parents who oppose vaccines point to the profit model of the American medical system, with one parent urging 13 WHAM News to "ask doctors how much money they're making by pushing vaccines." Dr. Pichichero says it's a misconception that pediatricians have a financial incentive to get children vaccinated.
 
"In large HMO organizations like the Kaiser Permanente system in California, doctors do get report cards about the percentage of fully vaccinated individuals, and if they don't achieve a high enough level, it would be a negative on thier private practice capabilities. Here in Rochester, there are no health care plans that incentivize doctors to give vaccines." He adds, "We make almost no money when we give vaccines. We buy the vaccine and we are only allowed to charge the insurance company what we paid for it, and then we are given a very nominal charge -- like eight or nine dollars -- to store the vaccine, give the vaccine, get the needle and syringe, record everything that happens. It's not a money maker for us, but it is our obligation."
 
Ultimately, Dr. Pichichero expects the discussion to continue regarding vaccines. "We wish we didn't have to have this debate," he says. "I think the phrase 'firing parents' is too harsh. My colleagues who take this step are trying to help families and children. Dr. Janet Casey is serving as an advocate for the children who come to this office and spend time in the waiting room. I know that my colleagues in this position want parents to think very hard about these decisions. I respect that. And I suppose I wouldn't be surprised to see more doctors go in that direction."

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The views expressed here do not necessarily represent those of 13WHAM-TV || Rochester

sunsan - 9/20/2012 1:38 PM
0 Votes
What's funny about this is a patient is far more likely to fire their doctor than the other way around. SMM MD... stick that in your hat!

Kriegar - 9/20/2012 2:15 AM
0 Votes
@smm md A. Yes, if you are taking my money to buy a service, you are contracting to be my "employee" of sorts. B. DO get too technical here. Parents are not all morons, and if you're leaving one thing out because it is "too technical", some folks wonder what else you're leaving out. C. Agreed-the price of vaccinating being a selling point is absurd, uneducated, and beyond stupid as a consideration on the basis of ROI. What the hell does ROI have to do with the health, welfare, and safety of a child? D. "Discharging" (FIRING) a patient because of an informed decision made by an educated parent is not only shortsighted, but I suggest that it is less than ethical, and more likely based on insurance ramifications more than anything else. If you are not a good enough doctor to build a relationship of trust, and convince parents of something and its' safety, then who is at fault? The child who is not vaccinated? And frankly, their ARE real risks to vaccinations, and they are just as real as the dangers of non-vaccination.

Kriegar - 9/20/2012 2:14 AM
1 Vote
@smm md A. Yes, if you are taking my money to buy a service, you are contracting to be my "employee" of sorts. B. DO get too technical here. Parents are not all morons, and if you're leaving one thing out because it is "too technical", some folks wonder what else you're leaving out. C. Agreed-the price of vaccinating being a selling point is absurd, uneducated, and beyond stupid as a consideration on the basis of ROI. What the hell does ROI have to do with the health, welfare, and safety of a child? D. "Discharging" (FIRING) a patient because of an informed decision made by an educated parent is not only shortsighted, but I suggest that it is less than ethical, and more likely based on insurance ramifications more than anything else. If you are not a good enough doctor to build a relationship of trust, and convince parents of something and its' safety, then who is at fault? The child who is not vaccinated? And frankly, their ARE real risks to vaccinations, and they are just as real as the dangers of non-vaccination.

Kriegar - 9/20/2012 2:03 AM
1 Vote
I don't think that "firing parents" is too harsh a term to describe the practice. I believe in calling a spade a spade. I do question the necessity and/or logic in injecting aluminum into a child, much less formaldehyde, and the idea of causing a child to contract polio via a bad vaccine, or inflicting it upon someone else who is less informed does scare the hell out of me. And I support vaccination. I do not support firing parents for making an informed parenting decision, or lying and claiming that it is to "protect the children". I'm simply not buying that argument at all.

bborcyk - 9/19/2012 12:43 PM
0 Votes
People need to do more research before they make statements like "they would have to have a DISEASE to give it." If you don't understand the subject, don't make harsh comments about it. People can carry diseases and transmit them without even having them. Aside from that, just because you don't currently exhibit symptoms, don't assume you don't have anything. Also, any research can be swayed in any direction, if the researchers are already biased in some way. That is the reason why we have scholarly journals, so when the information is published, others can critique it or perform similar research, or even branch out in different directions. My point - do your homework before making any decision about anything, and please do not just look at wikipedia. And contrary to popular belief these days, there ARE doctors who still care about their patients, and they make recommendations based on this. Sometimes they care more about you than you care about yourself, and that is when they dismiss you. Sometimes it wakes people up, sometimes it doesn't. This time, it's about your kids who don't have the ability to make decisions for themselves, so you have to make them.

Marcella Mel - 9/18/2012 11:10 PM
1 Vote
What do you tell a parent whose son's speech completely stopped the day after his 12 month MMR shot?? and by 3 is diagnosed with autism...what happenes when the mother joins a support group and so many of the stories are similar? Then what?????? What is your response to that? PS my sister in law was fired by her OBGYN at 35 weeks for asking about a home birth! Which she went on to have anyways with no complications!

ICUinICU - 9/18/2012 5:56 PM
0 Votes
I think the docs are onto a good idea. It's easy for people to make decisions when there is no obvious consequence (until your child becomes ill). But the unseen risk to the other children in the waiting room, pregnant moms, and both employees and patients who may have impaired immune systems is very real. It's your right not to vaccinate your child. It's also your responsibility to accept the consequences.

Neece - 9/17/2012 2:44 PM
2 Votes
Good practice to get those parents who refuse to vaccinate their children to sign a waiver understanding the risks that will be posed on their children and the children they come in contact with. That being said, I know if my children get fatally sick due to some other parents misconceptions or negligence, I will sue them for everything they have or will ever venture to have. Good to get things in writing, always! As for firing the parents, good for them. I don't want my children exposed to fatal illnesses because of someone elses negligence!

philsalvatore - 9/16/2012 8:21 PM
1 Vote
Doctors have every right to refuse to treat unvaccinated patients, children or adults. Likewise, schools not only have a right but a positive duty to the other students, teachers, and staff to refuse enrollemtn to any unvaccinated child. Period. No excuses.

smm md - 9/16/2012 7:09 PM
2 Votes
@Delores - doctors can and do fire patients. I am a pediatrician and I don't dismiss patients for immunizations because, like the doc in the article, I can often convince the parents to get some/most of them and because I still feel the child needs care - however, I have certainly "fired" patients for non-compliance (not holding up their end of the treatment plan) and for failure to keep appts. I am not your employee, I am a professional who has spent years training to utilize that knowledge to preserve the health and wellbeing of my patients. While I respect the rights of parents to make decisions for their child, I also understand the child is a helpless party to the outcomes of those decisions. I currently take care of 2 children who have suffered devastating effects from vaccine preventable illness whose parents chose not to vaccinate. Interestingly, I have NEVER had, in 18 years, a child who has had even remotely similar or detrimental effects from the vaccines themselves. And for those who are worried about additives - stop talking about "mercury" because it isn't in the routine vaccines and hasn't been for years! It's also the wrong 'type' of mercury and causes no harm but we won't get too technical here. Also almost all vaccines now ARE single dose, which does indeed cost more - so don't gripe about the cost of medical care then. And the doc is correct that most vaccines net a doc $10 or less above the cost of the medicine and for that $10 we have to train staff, buy the needles/syringes, keep detailed legal records, check lots, have commercial refrigerators/freezers, have a back up plan and carry insurance in case of power failure. While the waiting room is important many doctors 'discharge' patients who don't vaccinate because they see vaccination as SO integral to good medical care that if you can't agree on that, everything else is a wash. The doctor/patient relationship is already broken.
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